Fox News host Mike Huckabee says the Newtown shooting blame should not be on soft gun control laws, but on a lack of God. That the Secular-Progressives have ′systematically removed God′ from our schools. Concepts such as what responsibility means have been lost in our society thanks to Liberals and their political objectives. So is Mike Huckabee correct in his hypothesis that the reason Adam Lanza shot up the Sandy Hook school, killing 6 adult women and 20 First Graders is a lack of God? The issue of gun control laws have already been raised, but could there be a different reason?
Another Fox News contributor, psychiatrist Dr. Keith Ablow, one of Glenn Beck′s old chums, paints a different picture. For the past two days, he has been beating the drum about the failures of our nation′s mental health system. Ablow contends that there is no real oversight or method for at risk patients to truly get the help they need, nor much of an official trail that police and other government agencies can respond and act with.
As pieces of the puzzle concerning why Adam Lanza committed his crimes are discovered, Dr. Ablow may be on the right track. We now have learned that Lanza′z mother, Nancy, whom Adam murdered first as he began his day of violence, was not a substitute teacher at Sandy Hook as earlier reported. She was a school nurse at a different school, but had quit that job to care for Adam. Reports of earlier confrontations and problems that Adam had while in the Newtown public school system led his mother to pull him out and home school Adam.
Connecticut already has fairly strict gun control laws on their books. All of the weapons used by Lanza were legally purchased by his mother. This includes an AR-15 variant, known as the Bushmaster, which early reports claim was found in the mother′s car Adam drove to the Sandy Hook school. There now seems to be evidence that Adam in fact used the Bushmaster during his rampage. The rifle would have been ′grandfathered′ by the state′s laws concerning ′assault weapons′, military type rifles that are semi-automatic versions and usually have their muzzle breaks and bayonet rings removed to get around legal issues.
That political forces have been busy taking God out of our schools, and society in general, is no secret. Especially during these holiday periods, where groups use the courts to oppose Nativity displays, Christmas trees and other symbols of religious faith. But is this really connected to the Newtown shooting?
Take for example on the very same day, police in Bartlesville, Oklahoma arrested an 18-year old high school student, Sammie Eaglebear Chavez, who plotted to massacre his classmates. Chavez attempted to recruit friends to assist him in trapping students in the high school auditorium, chain the doors, then gun them down. But unlike in Newtown, the intentions of Chavez were made known to police after his friends told school officials. Unlike Chavez, Adam Lanza apparently had no friends he could trust.
There were clear warning signs and in the Chavez case, authorities were made aware of them and acted, preventing another tragedy. One would think that in a small community like Newtown, where most people are known to others, that Adam Lanza would have been on the radar screen. We may find out in the days to come that there were indeed signs, but for some reason, nobody acted in time. One story now floating is that Adam murdered his mother because she was in fact going through the legal process to have him institutionalized. If true, then Dr. Ablow may be right in his position that what we have here is a failure for the process, from diagnosis, to probate courts, to determining a course for treatment.
Mike Huchabee is right that the Newtown shooting blame does not fall on gun control laws. We already have plenty and the system generally works well. Whether the ′systematically removed God′ from public schools is to blame for Adam Lanza and his attack on the Sandy Hook Elementary school is another question. While it is true that Secular-Progressives have been busy with their political agenda, which includes removing what responsibility means, can we blame that? Or is Dr. Keith Ablow, another Fox News contributor, correct in his assessment that what we have here is a breakdown of our national mental health care system? Since the 1960s, the criminally insane with violent tendencies are less likely to be removed from society and instead treated by social workers rather than professional doctors. Is it time we rethink how we deal with such people?










December 16th, 2012 at 7:21 am
First, Huckabee couldn’t wait?
The shooter wasn’t attending school, was he?
And why should God be in school?
They have a school for God, it is called church and it is readily available.
Do they teach math at church?
No, because that is not the curriculum.
Perhaps we should look into every child being raised on Ritalin and then transitioning to Adderall.
Ask anyone from the ages of 15 to 27 about how many of their friends are taking Adderall or Strattera.
There is your problem.
God? Heck I wonder how many of these shooters think God told them to do it.
December 16th, 2012 at 7:43 am
Following that logic, more secular 1st world countries should be having mass murders more often than we do.
I’m glad we are taking God out of public schools – because they are PUBLIC SCHOOLS. I wouldn’t want my kids to be indoctrinated by schools paid for by taxes. Kids can pray in schools, they can bring their bibles and read them during break, etc, but teachers can’t push God onto kids and that’s a good thing. We are a nation with the freedom of religion, so why should be cater to a specific one? Would you like teachers to indoctrinate kids into the Muslim faith just because that’s what they believe?
Also, like Buzz said, there’s a place to learn about God called churches, there are also religious schools.
I find it disgusting that people are speaking for ‘God’ and saying that this massacre happened because God is not in the school system. If that’s the case then God is one DISGUSTING fellow and I’d rather burn in hell anyway.
December 16th, 2012 at 7:51 am
Here’s Morgan Freeman’s take:
“You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here’s why.
It’s because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single victim of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he’ll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.
CNN’s article says that if the body count “holds up”, this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer’s face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer’s identity? None that I’ve seen yet. Because they don’t sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you’ve just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.
You can help by forgetting you ever read this man’s name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news.”
December 16th, 2012 at 7:53 am
I kind of agree with you, Buzz. Huckabee is an idiot. Never liked him and I still don’t think much about him.
On the issue of blaming a ‘lack of God’, well, that is another matter. Since I do not know as of yet what the religious affiliation and habits were of the Lanza family, there is no point in arguing.
From my own experience, having been raised a Catholic, I flirted with atheism for a time. That is the old joke, most atheists are former Catholics. I remember first hearing about evolution in the 4th grade and being a science geek, took to it like a fish to water.
But as time went on, it became very clear to me that science has its limitations. Or maybe I should say the human mind is limited to the norms of our society and culture. Last night, on BBC America, they replayed the final, 2-part episodes of Star Trek: The Next Generation, where Picard’s old nemesis, Q, had him shifting about in different time periods. The moral of the story being that for one brief moment, with Q’s help, Picard achieved a small slice of enlightenment.
Which, I have to say, proudly, is my goal in life! Enlightenment! Humans are never going to know everything. Where science and reason ends, faith and religion takes over, but only to a point. Since the early 1970s, I’ve tried just about everything, from transcendental meditation to fasting to five LSD trips seek out and search for enlightenment. The best results were my last LSD trip in 1981 where I did become ‘one with the universe’ and later in 1992 when I became ‘born again’ in my belief of God.
This is why I have no trouble compartmentalizing the realms of science and religion. God created the universe and gave it a nice set of laws to function with. If you watch the rerun of the Neil Cavuto special today at 3pm Eastern on the Apollo program, you’ll see that most of our astronauts believe in God, or if you prefer, ‘Intelligent Design.’
These are people steeped in science, engineering and plenty of self-confidence. Astronauts, especially the old-fashion ones, are not exactly personalities who cling to the Bible as a ‘buffer’ to reality. They are ‘hands-on’ guys who have no problem trusting in their skills as they operate a deadly, hurtling piece of complex machinery.
I think I’m starting to babble, so I’ll end it at here and see other others feel on the subject.
December 16th, 2012 at 7:57 am
Ah, should have double-checked the sources before submtting. According to snopes Freeman didn’t say that, but the message still stands.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:04 am
Oh, Snow! First off, not everyone at Fox News is doing as you say. Judge Janine Pero (sp?) has made it a point not to say Lanza’s name during her program. I think one or two other hosts during their ‘news’ broadcasts also avoid giving any of these crazy shooters extra publicity. As for showing pictures, ABC News was the first to air one of Lanza.
As for the old issue of religion and government, our Founding Fathers never intended complete separation of God and government. We see over and over again terms like ‘divine providence’ in our founding documents.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:06 am
God should not be in schools. Period. There is a place for that, and it’s not in public schools.
Kids should (and are) be allowed to pray, but schools should not indoctrinate kids, that’s not their job.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:07 am
We may as well also talk about the impact of these violent computer and video games. Ever since the creation of DOOM, we have see that many of these mass shooting suspects were involved in playing such games.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:08 am
Also, I’m not a fan of mainstream media (liberal or conservative), so I don’t give a crap who did what first, that’s just useless finger-pointing. All news channels are sensationalizing this to death, even if a few personalities don’t follow suit.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:14 am
LOL! Schools should not indoctrinate kids??? What do you think they do all day? I believe that the Latin origins of Education, ‘edu’ means to conduct, to channel. Our education system is all about indoctrination. THAT is the problem!
I think we would all be better off doing away with the current school system and allow children to be taught by wise men, philosophers, in parks and playgrounds. People who instruct children to develop genuine thinking skills and allow them to figure things out on their own.
What we have now in public schools is basically just a prison to keep kids off the streets for a few hours a day. To learn by rote and vomit back whatever nonsense the teachers tell them so they can pass a test. Not very enlightening!
December 16th, 2012 at 8:15 am
Don’t you think the media itself may be a big reason for this? They create famous villans out of these sickos, which seems like a good deal if you’re an evil sh*t-stain. All you have to do is be more heinous than the last sicko and you will be remembered forever. Like the quote above says, can you name a single victim of the Columbine shootings? The Aurora shootings? Probably not without looking it up on the internet, but you probably know the names of the shooters, and you probably wont forget.
If we are going to blame video games, then we should blame violence on TV, right?
December 16th, 2012 at 8:16 am
To invoke GOD into a tragedy like Sandy Hook massacre opens the door to blame. America has been busy rejecting the notion of GOD in every part of their lives, school, government, public functions, with the notion that there are no laws or commandments that any society should teach other than those set forth by man. When all traces of GOD and the ten commandments are gone, who does anyone think will replace him? Whether a person chooses to believe in GOD or not is their own choice, but to choose to remove the ten commandments or any trace of scripture that teach good, moral guidelines for any society, shows the ignorance of those that cannot see beyond their own reason.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:16 am
What we have now in public schools is basically just a prison to keep kids off the streets for a few hours a day. To learn by rote and vomit back whatever nonsense the teachers tell them so they can pass a test. Not very enlightening!
I happen to agree with you here. Our school systems do suck.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:21 am
Well, Snow, I myself do not watch horror movies, nor do I watch these shows like ‘The Walking Dead’ nor the whole CSI and Law&Order franchises. After reading a few Stephen King novels, especially ‘The Stand’, I had my fill of that genre, too! If I want to watch crime or see bloodshed, all I have to do is look out my window here in Duh-troit.
Where, BTW, even with armed guards, metal detectors and other precautions, we still have school violence.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:24 am
If we are going to blame video games then we should blame the parents for allowing their kids to play such video games. All video games have an ESRB rating which will tell parents what the game contains.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:24 am
Lets also consider the music kids listen to these days. All the hip-hop, gangsta-rap tunes about killing cops and beating up women. If you want to really try to end this nonsense, there are a whole lot more places to look than just gun control laws.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:28 am
Well, Snow, there you go! Blame the parents!
One of my favorite authors, Robert Heinlein, did the subject best in his classic novel, ‘Starship Troopers’ where all teachers were ex-military. All parents were ex-military. Unless you served and put your own life on the line, taking personal responsibility for the survival of the human race, you could not vote, nor run for office, nor teach in a school nor be allowed to raise a family.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:31 am
Citizenship, good citizenship, is a lot more than just happen to being born somewhere. A lot more than just punching a clock and going home to a fridge full of beer and stick&ball sports on TV. A good citizen is somebody who really wants to be a good citizen and is willing to work on it. Even if it means risking your own life.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:32 am
I don’t believe in gun control. If someone is motivated to do this then they will find a way to obtain guns illegally, or they will find another way to murder.
So are you saying the big gubmint should regulate music, video games and other forms of violent entertainment.
Don’t you think media sensationalism could play a pretty big role?
Millions of people play violent video games and never resort to violence. Perhaps we need better access to heath care, in this case mental heath care?
December 16th, 2012 at 8:34 am
Heinlein is a favorite of mine too. I especially like ‘The Moon is a Harsh Mistress’.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:39 am
Actually, Snow, what I think I’m saying is that it is because of Big Government that we have all of these violent games, movies, books, music, etc. If we governed ourselves more locally, then each community would have its own standards and practices. Then it would be a matter of voting with your feet and living in a community that represented you best. These idiots in Washington do more harm when they try to help us than if they just left us alone.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:41 am
Heinlein was unique. He was that Libertarian bridge between the ‘Far Right’ and the Hippie movement. An amazing guy who really deserves more attention and respect than he gets.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:42 am
I’m having trouble making sense of that. It’s because of big government why we have violent games? Wouldn’t a big government regulate the industry so these violent games couldn’t exist, or they would be harder to access?
December 16th, 2012 at 8:45 am
Theres no way you can competently teach history in any school without God or religion being a major factor in many instances.
For example,one must study Christianity and Islam in order to understand the centuries of middle east unrest.
As far as God being taught as a moral compass to any number of demographics in a public school… thats just retarded.
My reason for never supporting Huckabee, a decent man, was because he’s just too much of an altar boy for my taste in any public office.
As a conservative, hes frightening.
And hes a really shtty bass player.
God might of made a difference in this murderers life but its hardly the fault of our schools for not teaching ten commandments.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:48 am
As for our mental health care system, Snow, that is what Dr. Keith Ablow says is the problem we have. If you think about it, before a number of ACLU-favored court rulings in the 1960s, the violent, criminally insane people were locked away for life. Many were also sterilized, too, just in case whatever made them insane was hereditary.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:50 am
Yes, he’s a fantastic author with a unique voice. He often has his soapbox character (Jean Dubois in ‘Starship Troopers’, Jubal Harshaw in ‘Stranger in a Strange Land’), but I enjoy those passages and characters. Also, his juvenile stuff is really fun, I really like ‘The Puppet Masters’.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:52 am
“It’s because of big government why we have violent games? ”
Big government is a violent game that never ends well.
Snow…
If the fed were not so prevalent it would be much easier to construct communities that were not part of a massive collective.
But, what can I say.
On one hand some want the fed to align or butt out with states that legalize pot while the same people want the fed to over ride laws like Arizonas immigration laws, which are the same as the feds immigration laws.
Go figure
December 16th, 2012 at 8:53 am
Also, Lazarus Long is awesome.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:54 am
Yes, Micky, Huckabee is a RINO! He’s no Conservative. He was also one of the anti-Beck leaders at Fox, too! Which should tell us a lot. Both Huckabee and Sean Hannity were jealous of Glenn Beck.
Snow, if local government could function freely without federal intervention, then some places probably would have bans on violent games and such. I’m not saying that such should be illegal, but people should have the right to protect themselves and their children as they see fit.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:56 am
Take care, all, and have a blessed day! Time for lunch, then a nap, then get ready for the big Survivor finale tonight. Heh-heh-heh!
December 16th, 2012 at 8:57 am
Huckabee a RHINO? Now I’ve heard it all.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:57 am
Oops, RINO.
December 16th, 2012 at 10:30 am
Yeah Snow, calling him a rino is not too far fetched when you have to realize that conservative republicans want their government out of their church and business as much as they want their church out of their government and business.
You can accept that your God given rights be protected by the government with the understanding that your God does not have to be a Judeo-Christian God but rather your creator or a creator under any belief.
We spoke of your Aunts situation at St. Marks yesterday. One suggestion was that you appeal to Catholic Charities or some other churches that might lend a hand. Many of them will if you can show evidence of financial burdens that outweigh income.
If they ask that you partake in services or worship that would be wrong and I would rightfully tell em to go fck themselves.
However, I doubt this would happen as I’ve seen many of my clients here go to Catholic charities and get assistance without any strings attached.
Bring pay stubs and bills and they’ll do the math and decide.
I think I told you what the hospital run by Seventh Day Adventists did for me and my 24G bill.
Good luck, tell Aunty I said wuzzup.
December 16th, 2012 at 10:42 am
We will definitely check out all avenues and we both very much appreciate your thoughts and gratitude, as well as the thoughts and prayers of your fellows.
Right now we are watching the Broncos kick the Ravens ASS! Alright, it’s only 3-0 Broncos right now, but hopefully they will kick their ass! Ravens will be tough though.
December 16th, 2012 at 12:48 pm
Interesting comments about God, guns, video games, media reporting, etal. Perhaps it is some of the above or all of the above, since explanations are not always single variable equations.
The Lanza’s were a liberal family — the mom signed a crackpot petition two years ago — but we cannot blame that per se. The guys was just a mental case, that is pretty obvious. It is interesting to note, however, that most of the violent crime in this country is committed by the left.
December 16th, 2012 at 1:14 pm
We could also say that most of the crime is committed by the religious. I believe something like 15% of America doesn’t believe in God (perhaps it’s more now), but atheists comprise of less than 1% of the prison population.
December 16th, 2012 at 1:51 pm
simple minded people find god smart people find answers ..even to this ,sickest of sick acts …mental health , definitely one problem ,guns and assault weapons definitely another problem ..whackos with guns another problem … Americans are to violent surely another problem…but god was at that school as the children hid and feared for their lives …god was to busy ….
December 16th, 2012 at 2:11 pm
I fail to see how a 1% Atheist population makes any case that the religious are more criminal.
Most Americans do believe in God.
The ones that really fck up my head are Christian liberals, which make as much sense as Jewish liberals.
And the fact still stands, most inmates are liberals.
These are the ass holes who all think they’re freaking John Gotti but have crucifixes tattooed all over their asses.
These are the morons who take scrap threads and make their own crucifixes, the first to order Rosaries from the store, the first to ask for a bible, and the first to sht can them all the day they’re released.
So, lets not get carried away by saying most criminals are religious.
These ass holes hardly represent what these religions represent.
We only need to look as far as the middle east to see what happens when religion is subverted to personal ideology.
December 16th, 2012 at 2:56 pm
sean;
“god was to busy ….”
Is that why you’re here ?
December 16th, 2012 at 2:59 pm
I’m sick of this guilt-by-association BS that constantly goes on. I’m not saying I’m innocent, but seriously this crap does get old after awhile. Even if there are more liberals in prison, who cares. Not everything boils down to political ideology. We can pull negative stats for both sides, easily.
As hard as it is to believe, there are actually good, caring Democrats who work hard, earn their keep, pay their dues and lead good, normal lives, same with Republicans. This red vs blue demonizing stuff is really getting old now. Again, I’m not innocent of this, I bash more than I should, but the polarization that happens in this country seems to be doing a LOT more damage than good.
We can go back and forth all f*cking day with this crap. Are certain groups like gang-bangers and welfare queens more democratic? Sure, but I’m not either of those, I have never even been inside a prison, I don’t take advantage of entitlements, and the worst thing I’ve been busted for is driving without proof of insurance. There are many other Democrats like me. We can also stereotype Republicans, atheists, the religious, etc.
All this back-and-forth poo-flinging is getting us nowhere. We simply will not change each other’s minds on certain issues, so vomiting up this same rhetoric time and time again is just a waste of time.
December 16th, 2012 at 3:12 pm
snow crash when you go thru the numbers and get the truth about your so-called welfare queens you will see that white poor southerners almost 2 to 1 on the welfare roles across this nation and white poor make up as high a percentage based on population then any other group …if you go to the bible belt in the Midwest you will find some counties with as many as 78% of the population on some kind of assistance (this does not include american Indian or people on reservations )and these people are overwhelmingly white conservative christian ..these numbers can be found in the last census at the census reporting websites of the government
December 16th, 2012 at 3:15 pm
TO MICKEY ….I’m here the old fashioned way sex between to people .and 9 months later …well I hope you know the rest …but for you to suggest god had something to do with it is flattering …I’ll have to ask my mom if she was a virgin and new a guy named the holy spirit..
December 16th, 2012 at 3:20 pm
Yes indeed, I do agree with Snow Crash about the rhetoric. Trying to find a “big” reason for a specific incident like this is probably a waste of time.
I think what is more useful to look at is the spike in crime rates that has occurred the last two years, of which this incident must be put into context. Could have a lot to do with Obama’s economic mess, or other factors speculated about on this thread: movement away from faith, the media, video games, and even the proliferation of guns.
And completely aside from this massacre, it really is a good question to answer why lefties commit most of the violent crime and are clogging our prison system. Perhaps the changes in educational system over the last two decades have something to do with it, including the lower behavioral bar set in our schools today, and the movement away from the melting pot concept that kids learned until 30 years ago.
December 16th, 2012 at 3:24 pm
to mickey ..the atheist population in america is closer to 19% ..the non christian population makes up another 22%.. Hindu, Jew, Buddhist, Muslim, other… so to think we are a predominantly christian country is crazy …and by the way Tim McVeigh was a born again christian.. the tower shooter in Texas was a protestant pastor in training in religious studies school ..lee Harvey Oswald grew up devout Episcopal… other examples include the dc sniper a confirmed practicing baptist ..the murder of several woman at abortion clinics was a devout Calvinistic protestant…so before you go of saying atheists do these crimes you should know the truth
December 16th, 2012 at 3:27 pm
to Patrick MC Cain; your argument is as daft as that idiot senator senile joke john McCain …any relation…huh??
December 16th, 2012 at 3:34 pm
“I’m sick of this guilt-by-association BS that constantly goes on. ‘
Most guys in jail say they’re innocent victims.
Its hard to ignore that when liberals play that card in or out of jail.
All I know is this.
After I gave up being a liberal and took to more conservative lifestyle I sobered up and stopped ending up in jail.
I’m not a religious nut, I like my weed, loud music, my drums, sex, sayin what I think,but found it too easy to keep killing myself by blaming others or expecting them to help me because I felt anyone with more than me should.
Stopped looking at the world as some basin of injustice and instead a place with endless potential for good.
I’m an individual, no longer a member of a collective thats supposed to owe me something.
December 16th, 2012 at 3:37 pm
mickey you did not give up being a liberal you gave up being a douchbag..no liberal that I know believes as you say they do …you believed that not because of liberalism ..but because you used to be a loser …
December 16th, 2012 at 3:38 pm
“but for you to suggest god had something to do with it is flattering …”
Dude, wtf are you talking about ?
You’re the one trying to make the case it was the absence of God.
Read my posts before you yap any further.
You’ll see that I’m pointing to how we deal with mental illness and that Huckabee is an idiot
December 16th, 2012 at 3:40 pm
“mickey you did not give up being a liberal you gave up being a douchbag.”
Same thing
December 16th, 2012 at 3:42 pm
“so before you go of saying atheists do these crimes you should know the truth”
Where did I say that ?
Take a hike moron
December 16th, 2012 at 3:45 pm
I fail to see how a 1% Atheist population makes any case that the religious are more criminal.
Most Americans do believe in God.
The ones that really fck up my head are Christian liberals, which make as much sense as Jewish liberals.
And the fact still stands, most inmates are liberals.
These are the ass holes who all think they’re freaking John Gotti but have crucifixes tattooed all over their asses.
These are the morons who take scrap threads and make their own crucifixes, the first to order Rosaries from the store, the first to ask for a bible, and the first to sht can them all the day they’re released.
So, lets not get carried away by saying most criminals are religious.
These ass holes hardly represent what these religions represent.
We only need to look as far as the middle east to see what happens when religion is subverted to personal ideology.
December 16th, 2012 at 3:49 pm
no atheist says what you say we say so asshole why don’t you go take a hike …your generalizations are childish…your assertions are unfounded and un based …and without the least intimate knowledge of the people you try to speak of…
December 16th, 2012 at 4:19 pm
Sean, you are welcome to comment here but you will have to raise up the bar. Please see the comment policy before continuing, and welcome to Right Pundits.
December 16th, 2012 at 5:07 pm
Sean, I’m trying to digest one nut already as it is. So please excuse my brevity.
You’re not making sense.
I never said Atheists are responsible for any level of crime. Only that Snow Crash’s number of 1% Atheists could hardly be a fair comparison to a population of more than 50% Christians.
That 50% + Christian majority actually holds more propensity for crime, as is true if you visit any prison. Albeit these people hardly represent Christians, but call themselves Christians.
I work with addicts and drunks.
The majority of them identify themselves as democrats as do inmates, most of which are incarcerated due to addictions or substance abuse.
If the majority of our country were Atheists then the math would allow them to be the criminal majority per-capita.
“and without the least intimate knowledge of the people you try to speak of…”
I dont need to be intimate with you to know by now that you truly have no idea what you’re saying.
December 16th, 2012 at 7:49 pm
Mick,
What I was trying to say was that since the US is comprised of about 15% atheists then you should see about the same % of atheists in prisons if they were as likely to commit crimes as non-atheists, however, atheists only comprise of about 1% of the prison population.
December 16th, 2012 at 8:45 pm
Gotcha, but its still not really relevant to me as theres Atheists who live decent lives, are decent people and there are those who say they believe in God(or claim to be Christian)and are hardly representative of the faith.
Sean is confused in that he thinks I’m saying all liberals are Atheists.
There are liberals who lean conservative, are pro life etc.
Now, whos to say that a good part of inmates are not Atheists ? I know for a fact that anyone in prison saying they believe there is no God dont do well. You can be Buddhist,Jewish,and any other belief of a diety and do fine but Godless makes you worse than the Christian criminal.
It gets confusing, its twisted and subjected to all kinds of sht which is why I’m not a member of any church or religion but simply believe I’m here for a purpose designated by a higher power I chose as the God of Abraham and think Jesus is the wisest prophet ever.
The miracles I take with a grain of salt.
A good many inmates only say they’re Christians so they can appeal to whatever benefits them by saying so.
I dont have a hard time imagining a good many of these guys actually believing there is no God.
I’m pro life, so I have a hard time with those who claim to be Christians who not just support abortion, but promote it.
I have no problem with very early term abortions, but once that heart starts beating, leave it alone.
Drifting back to sean, I should of made clear the difference between “Christians” and those who believe in “God”. Most Americans believe in some God, but not all of that majority believe in the same God.
Bottom line is like this.
Those whos lives have been fcked up and never looked to God have done better when they do look to God or take faith in higher powers.
I should know otherwise I wouldnt suggest to drunks and addicts to get a life of some faith if I didnt care.
And it works.
And,,,it wont work if you fake it.
These monsters who kill little kids and shoot up theaters are beyond comprehending truth in tangible concrete aspects of life , never mind spirituality, because they’re fcking sick in the head, minds damaged recently or from the start.
They’re mistakes and part of an imperfect world that we with our God given gifts must make right.
I’m not one to pray for anything but strength to do better and whats right because faith without works is dead.
I cuss out God all the time but thank him daily for a world still full of more blessings than evil.
A lot of people are Atheists by mistake because they were mislead from the beginning.
A lot of people are Christian(in name) only because of peer pressure.
So, this whole thing about religion, or lack of being responsible for crime means little to me.
I do however see more of a correlation between ideologies and crime that I do religion and crime.
December 17th, 2012 at 5:05 am
First off, we should really distinguish between the atheist and the amoral. You can claim to be religious and still be amoral, and it is the lack of morals that plays a larger role in violent behavior. Micky makes a good point about Mafia members who appear on the surface to be ‘good Catholics’ but still go out and murder. These types of people are sociopaths, plain and simple.
December 17th, 2012 at 5:13 am
Another point which needs to be raised is while the shooting in Newtown is tragic and the imagery of 20 small children brutally shot to death is horrifying, it is no less macabre than the killing that goes on every day of infants, or fetuses if you prefer, in abortion clinics across the country. A whole lot of people profit from the various forms of blood lust which seems to be dominating our Progressive society.
It is very disingenuous for Obama to shed a tear for the children of Newtown while he supports laws that allow for fully developed infants to be aborted, tossed into a garbage bin and left to die.
December 17th, 2012 at 5:17 am
Oh, BTW, Snow, yes, Huckabee is a RINO! The guy never saw a tax increase he didn’t like. Also, as governor, he was one one of the first to launch a Nanny-State program to combat obesity. I’m sure if he were still a governor, Arkansas would now also have laws against using table salt or Big Gulps and ban vending machines from selling candy and chips.
December 17th, 2012 at 6:19 am
Patrick, the average violent crime rate (murder, forcible rape, robbery, aggravated assault) in 2008 for the 28 states that voted for Barack Obama in the 2008 was 389 incidents per 100,000 residents. The average violent crime rate for the 22 states that voted for John McCain was 412 incidents per 100,000 residents. So your assessment that liberals are more violent is flawed as those on the right have a 5.8 percent higher incidence of violent crime. Perhaps you can give us some numbers to justify your claim or maybe better define “the left”. Or maybe as you say, “raise up the bar” for your argument.
Wading through the monstrosity of gibberish, I really don’t know where to start. Andy reminds me of a dog chasing his own tail. The main theme seems to be to keep open the possibility that Huckabee’s outrageous assessment has validity without denouncing it for what it is. So, did the NewTown Catholic Church receive a bomb threat because they too “systematically removed God”? We’ve endured church shootings as well so that pretty much discredits Huckabee’s exploitation as well as Andy’s invoking it.
Trying to follow Andy’s logic further, he wants less government regulations while seeming to want more government regulations on the video industry. He wants “smaller government” yet as I recall, he approved of Michigan’s Governor appointed financial czars to dissolve the smaller governments with a big government takeover. Andy even suggests that government should regulate what music we’re aloud to listen to as (post #16) “there are a whole lot more places to look than just gun control laws”. Reading further, I’m picking up (post# 17) that Andy approves of government regulating a persons God given right to reproduce and raise a family unless they’ve served in armed forces. And we can’t blame parents (it’s all those overpaid teacher’s fault and school “is basically just a prison to keep kids off the streets for a few hours a day”) dispite the fact that teachers have the kids 1080 hours a year(180 days times 6 hours a day) and parents have them 3330 hrs a yr. I’m not sure where he’s going with imprisoning and sterilizing certain undesirables as like the Huckabee spew, he somewhat tap dances around that.
I’m trying to wrap my head around this mindset or how you deduce what you do. It’s kinda like that budget thing where you approved of Boehner agreeing to up the taxes on the rich as long as no taxes are raised on the rich. Like so many of your arguments, that makes no sense. I reread Andy’s take on “where science and reason ends, faith and religion takes over” looking for logic and came up short. So the only way I can argue or rationalize on your level is to do as Andy and learn to hate the left with all my fiber, selectively choose reality and science over religion and fantasy, drop a hit of acid, and ponder the outcome. I’m just not willing to do that.
December 17th, 2012 at 7:16 am
Hah-hah, Ronald, you numbskull!
My point in raising the issue of video games and music is that the notion of just legally restricting what firearms citizens may own is not going to amount to a hill of beans in preventing future violence. We certainly do not need Big Government from Washington telling us how to live our lives.
December 17th, 2012 at 8:13 am
“Perhaps you can give us some numbers to justify your claim or maybe better define “the left”. Or maybe as you say, “raise up the bar” for your argument.”
Right, you get to post numbers you pulled out of nowhere and then accuse McCain of the same thing.
Are you actually going to try and tell us that our prisons are not full of minorities which in large part always vote democrat ? HUH ?
n.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_States#Race
Obama was elected by almost all blacks, took the Hispanic vote, and a significant amount of whites.
Take those stats and then look at your prison population by race and you’ll see thats theres no doubt the majority of those imprisoned are liberals.
December 17th, 2012 at 8:24 am
“And we can’t blame parents (it’s all those overpaid teacher’s fault and school “is basically just a prison to keep kids off the streets for a few hours a day”) dispite the fact that teachers have the kids 1080 hours a year(180 days times 6 hours a day) and parents have them 3330 hrs a yr. ”
Wow, you really are not too bright.
You’re saying that Andys claim to schools being prisons is not valid because they’re not there 24/7/365 days a year ?
You’re an idiot who changes everything people say so you can make bullsht arguments that serve only to make you think you appear more intelligent.
December 17th, 2012 at 8:44 am
Andy, your convictions on big gov or most any political issue tends to be contingent on what the politician is selling it, what financial source is backing it, or if there’s a “D” or an “R” attached to their name. You don’t want big gov but bow to Gov Rick Snider shoving legislation down the constituents throats that replaces their small elected gov with the bigger state gov. You don’t believe in hand outs yet you’re fine with working class paying corporation who pay negative taxes. And I could go on and on.
December 17th, 2012 at 10:00 am
This is certainly “selective”.
Just like budget discussions that propose cutting everything, BUT, defense, this whole thread seems to be a long-winded deviation from ANYTHING associated with guns. Even “Obama’s economy” was trotted out. Really?
I am sure many of you saw the story about the man in China stabbing over 20 people. They all lived. Why? It takes a long time to stab 20 people.
Even if you eliminate the gun issue, at least consider the de-funding and/or closure of most state mental facilities. Those people now either end up homeless or incarcerated.
Read this article by a woman who has been trying to raise an “Adam Lanza”.
She was told repeatedly they could not help and that she should arrange for her son to be arrested.
The article is entitled “I am Adam Lanza’s Mother”. It is heart-wrenching.
http://now.msn.com/i-am-adam-lanzas-mother-says-mom-of-mentally-ill-son?
As I mentioned a couple of days ago, you have a generation raised on Ritalin who transition to Adderall in their teen years. Good luck dealing with increasing numbers of them.
Also watch the Scarborough plea (yeah, yeah, I know, RINO or something like that) who despite having the highest NRA rating possible while he served, and until a week ago maintained his stance on guns, finally says, “enough”.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp=50222624�
December 17th, 2012 at 10:54 am
From Rupert Murdoch:
The owner of Fox News disagrees with his own network stars about tighter gun control. Rupert Murdoch, billionaire proprietor of the conservative-leaning news network, wrote on Twitter late Friday: “Terrible news today. When will politicians find courage to ban automatic weapons?” Fox is home to contributors who usually oppose new gun restrictions, but when the channel’s paymaster dissents, will that signal a tipping point in the gun control debate?
December 17th, 2012 at 12:20 pm
“From Rupert Murdoch:”
Yeah, were all just one big bot network jcked into Murdochs head
This is societal and mental health issue but leave it up to moonbats to use it impose more regulation.
Which in the case with drugs and guns never works.
Go after everyone that owns guns and not the nuts that abuse them.
Gotcha.
I could walk into any mall with a semi automatic pistol and 5 clips and do the same damage.
“Its the people stupid”
=================
“Andy, your convictions on big gov or most any political issue tends to be contingent on what the politician is selling it, what financial source is backing it, or if there’s a “D” or an “R” attached to their name. You don’t want big gov but bow to Gov Rick Snider shoving legislation down the constituents throats that replaces their small elected gov with the bigger state gov. You don’t believe in hand outs yet you’re fine with working class paying corporation who pay negative taxes. And I could go on and on.”
There you go again, putting your garbage renditions in other people mouths.
Andy simply wants the states to have more control over their municipalities than the fed.
December 17th, 2012 at 3:38 pm
“Joe Manchin, a conservative Democratic senator and a National Rife Association member, suggested this morning that it’s time to discuss new regulations on assault weapons and that Washington needs to “move beyond rhetoric” when dealing with gun control.”
“I don’t know anyone in the sporting or hunting arena that goes out with an assault rifle,” the West Virginia senator said on MSNBC’s Morning Joe show. “I don’t know anyone that needs 30 rounds in a clip to go hunting. I mean, these are things that need to be talked about.”
Manchin, who boasts an “A” rating from the NRA and is a lifetime member of the pro-gun rights group, stopped short of proposing any specific regulations but suggested that “everything needs to be on the table,” adding that “anyone saying they don’t want to talk, to sit down, to have that type of dialogue is wrong.”
December 17th, 2012 at 5:42 pm
Yeah, so what ?
If I bring a semi automatic hand gun with all the clips I need whats the difference ?
In the most recent case it was determined that mental health was an issue.
But, it always starts this way with liberals wanting more gun regulation and completely ignoring the most contributing factors such as parents who allow their retarded kids access to her guns, failure to protect students, addressing mental issues
December 17th, 2012 at 5:47 pm
I mentioned mental health in an earlier post, but it never got past moderation.
I will try again.
December 17th, 2012 at 5:48 pm
This is certainly “selective”.
Just like budget discussions that propose cutting everything, BUT, defense, this whole thread seems to be a long-winded deviation from ANYTHING associated with guns. Even “Obama’s economy” was trotted out. Really?
I am sure many of you saw the story about the man in China stabbing over 20 people. They all lived. Why? It takes a long time to stab 20 people.
Even if you eliminate the gun issue, at least consider the de-funding and/or closure of most state mental facilities. Those people now either end up homeless or incarcerated.
Read this article by a woman who has been trying to raise an “Adam Lanza”.
She was told repeatedly they could not help and that she should arrange for her son to be arrested.
The article is entitled “I am Adam Lanza’s Mother”. It is heart-wrenching.
http://now.msn.com/i-am-adam-lanzas-mother-says-mom-of-mentally-ill-son?
As I mentioned earlier, you have a generation raised on Ritalin who transition to Adderall in their teen years. Good luck dealing with increasing numbers of them.
Also watch the Scarborough plea (yeah, yeah, I know, RINO or something like that) who despite having the highest NRA rating possible while he served, and until a week ago maintained his stance on guns, finally says, “enough”.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp=50222624�
December 17th, 2012 at 7:07 pm
I come from a country with extremely strict gun laws. We have massacres basically every weekend, dang criminals don’t obey the laws. Maybe we should make law-breakers illegal, that will stop them.
December 17th, 2012 at 7:26 pm
40,000 Syrians dead,…Syrias gun laws are only to protect dictators
With the weapons they’ve managed to acquire they will soon topple Assad.
Maybe all these anti-gun activist will look there to see why our second amendment is so very important.
December 17th, 2012 at 9:04 pm
buzzbee – Don’t hurt yourself. These gun people will never learn.
They have a fetish for having the power to kill.
December 18th, 2012 at 2:22 am
Power of defense. Do you realize that every single one of the signers of our Declaration of Independence owned a gun? Liberals are so silly in their seriousness about everything that doesn’t matter.
December 18th, 2012 at 4:37 am
“Don’t hurt yourself. These gun people will never learn.
They have a fetish for having the power to kill.”
Theres no one here among us thats given any reason to say such a stupid thing.
I mentioned gun right applications in countrys where its clear what happens when those citizens have no right to bear arms and you popcorn fart this crap outcher ass that “these” gun people like having the power to kill.
So much for you being able to have an honest conversation.
Who are “these” people” ?
Your example holds nothing relevant as its based only on your ignorance,opinion and bigotry.
My example gives a concrete example taking place in front of our very eyes.
Tell me Ron.
Assad has murdered 40,000 people, isnt it about time they’re allowed to defend themselves ?
Do you think its right that members of Irans national guard be allowed to force their way into your house and arrest you, take all your belongings,rape your wife and children, simply for googling the wrong thing, or speaking out against tyranny ?
Do you think its a good idea for any government to allow arms to their military only ?
Would you like to talk about the overwhelming amount of liberals who own guns legally or illegally that are jailed for violent weapons charges ?
I guess all them shooters in Detroit,Chicago, South central LA and the South Bronx are all republicans ?
Are you aware of just how many music videos there are of liberal musicians brandishing fire arms, glorifying them ?
Most likely not
The majority of prisoners are both blacks and hispanics. 92-97% of blacks voted for Obama and of course we all the majority of latinos voted for Obama as well.
Chew on that
December 18th, 2012 at 4:49 am
Buzz,
You conveniently forgot to mention the other cases in China…
7 kindergarten children killed by a man with a hammer and nails.
8 primary school murdered by a former teacher armed with a knife.
2 killed and 7 wounded by a man with a knife and a hatchet.
3 killed, including a 6-yr old girl by a man who was stoned to death by locals.
Just one month in 2010 there were 8 school attacks. Oh, and that incident where 22 children were stabbed but lived a few days ago, the guy did kill an old woman. Some of the 22 children are permanently scarred with missing fingers and ears.
December 18th, 2012 at 4:54 am
Ronald,
Believe it or not, I have been a critic of Rick Synder. I may in fact have been the first ‘blogger’ to rat him out as a RINO and have written about how he made his fortune. If you took the time to search and read some of my older articles, you’ll find that I’ve also went after George Romney and many other ‘Republicans’. So I do not put much credit to those letters (R or D) folks put after their names.
December 18th, 2012 at 7:12 am
So remind me why it is important for citizens to have semi-automatics that hold 30 clips?
What is the purpose of such weapons.
Defending your home? Against whom? The Huns?
How often do you hear of someone defending themselves with an assault weapon? Shouldn’t the name of these weapons tell you something? “Assault” weapon.
Defending yourselves against a tyrannical government? Oh, please. This isn’t Syria and if your government wants to “mess” with you there are no amount of assault weapons that will save you.
It shows how intractable many of you are.
Isn’t this a government run by the majority (and not the gun lobby and their surrogate the NRA)?
Polls show most people don’t think assault weapons should be legal. Even people known to be far-right are now admitting that it is time for a change.
What are the reasons that any of you think that we, as a populace, need assault weapons? Under what circumstances do you need 30 round clips?
So some of those in China lost an appendage? That is considerably different then children being shot 11 times.
How can you defend this?
Instead it is television shows and movies?
Do you think this is what was intended by the 2nd amendment? What is this, the Koran, where edicts are followed for eternity regardless of intent?
“A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed”
The purpose of the Second Amendment was to prevent the new Federal Government established in 1789 from disarming the state militias and replacing them with a Federal standing army. It was a concern that was relevant perhaps for a few years around the birth of the country. It is irrelevant today. Americans do not rely on state militias in 2012 for our freedom from the Federal government.
December 18th, 2012 at 7:21 am
“The boss might have been calling for gun control, but did the Fox News channel deliberately steer clear of the controversy last weekend? Top Fox News executives reportedly explicitly barred producers from raising the subject of gun control after the Sandy Hook school shootings in Connecticut. That despite the network’s proprietor, Rupert Murdoch, taking to Twitter to call on politicians to ban automatic weapons. The conservative-leaning network has tended to oppose calls for gun regulation in the past, which might explain its current silence on the issue — not unlike that of the National Rifle Association.”
Geez, can’t even talk about it?. Aren’t they a “news” organization? Wasn’t this a subject that was the topic of conversation in all quarters?
December 18th, 2012 at 9:10 am
The reality is Obama hasn’t done a thing about gun control and wouldn’t even talk about during the presidential campaign. Gun sales have soared during his presidency. If liberals want to complain about guns, then blame the guy with the most blood on his hands. Barack Obama.
December 18th, 2012 at 9:35 am
Well, gun sales soared because of the scaredy cat ‘run to the hills’ Republicans who think his reelection will cause the end of the world.
December 18th, 2012 at 9:37 am
“then blame the guy with the most blood on his hands. Barack Obama.”
You’re kidding me, right?
I know many of you are not Obama fans (to say the least), but this is where you choose to direct the blame?
Unbelievable.
Well then, to follow that reasoning if he comes out strongly against assault weapons (with what, a Presidential edict?) then it should easy, right?
December 18th, 2012 at 9:42 am
Raising the gun issue during the campaign would have been rather stupid, wouldn’t it?
No one asked and if he had raised issues that could’ve cost votes it would have been very unwise.
That is why the GOP putting abortion and contraception front and center was so ill-advised. On those issues they should have remained silent, but the Akins and company only opened their mouths to change feet.
December 18th, 2012 at 9:43 am
Again, why does anyone need an assault weapon with 30 rounds?
December 18th, 2012 at 10:00 am
“What is the purpose of such weapons.”
Even though weve had this conversation before,its actually non of your business.
Take a look at Syria, Egypt,and you’ll see the perfect example of why we have a 2nd amendment.
I asked hypothetical questions above.
No ones yet to answer than and I’m about go through the same crap all over again.
“Defending yourselves against a tyrannical government? Oh, please. This isn’t Syria and if your government wants to “mess” with you there are no amount of assault weapons that will save you.”
The Syrian people are winning with little more than a few grenade launchers and semi automatic weapons.
You never know, thats why the law/amendment stays.
Theres proof that the bank with the armed security guard sees less robberies.
This government is as close to collapse as its ever been.
Our second amendment is not there just for personal protection as well as its also a deter-ant from those who think they can start issuing eminent domain of property and freedoms.
We have guns in America and are far more peaceful than the muddle east were they have no weapons and have feuding among themselves for centuries”
Are you seriously saying only the government can own any weapon of their choice ?
You’re full of crap Buzz. FOX has brought up mental health on this issue so many times it ridiculous.
Every FOX show has raised the mental health
“It was a concern that was relevant perhaps for a few years around the birth of the country. It is irrelevant today. Americans do not rely on state militias in 2012 for our freedom from the Federal government.”
You may not think its relevant, thats too bad”
December 18th, 2012 at 11:31 am
We talk about video games and violent TV and such, but here’s a thought -
Somehow Canadian kids can manage to play violent video games and watch violent television and not go on brutal murder-sprees. I believe they have more strict gun laws than we do, too.
December 18th, 2012 at 11:37 am
“Well then, to follow that reasoning if he comes out strongly against assault weapons (with what, a Presidential edict?) then it should easy, right?”
No. It’s all about leadership. The president has a bully pulpit to rally the public and he has the ability to lead congress by proposing legislation. Unfortunately the president is a failed leader. He doesn’t have it any him to either lead the public or lead congress. Now of course he will make some noise about gun control because it looks cool politically. But where has he been over the last four years on this issue, or anything else?
December 18th, 2012 at 11:41 am
Why can’t anybody answer Buzz’s question?
December 18th, 2012 at 12:09 pm
It’s not a question of whether we may own weapons, but where we draw the line. We all draw it…. even the NRA.
Can I legally own a nuke? Of course not. A WMD? No. A tank…. not so much. (But oh so useful for rush hour.) A rocket launcher – no again. A rifle, sure. So somewhere in between rocket launcher and rifle we as a nation choose to draw a line. The question is where.
A car, operated improperly, can be a danger. So we make rules. I have a license to drive a car, for which I had to be trained and tested. And I had to show ID. Then I needed proof of insurance. If I am caught driving dangerously my right to drive it could be in jeopardy. And my insurance will certainly cost more.
Why? Because while I certainly have the RIGHT to drive a car, those with whom I share the road have the right to some measure of personal safety. So we draw some common sense lines.
Why do we have smart laws regulating cars and dumb laws regulating guns?
December 18th, 2012 at 1:41 pm
The answer to Buzz’s question is simple. If the principal had an assault weapon with 30 rounds tucked into her closet, she stood a chance against the shooter. If ever anyone should have had an assault weapon, it was her on that day.
TA says we should draw lines and of course he is right. I don’t have a big problem with scrutinizing assault weapons more closely. The problem is liberals always want more, so what would come next? Handguns because they suck for hunting?
December 18th, 2012 at 1:49 pm
Even in the wake of this incident, and many more like it, any talk of an effort to outlaw weapons that can rapidly fire 30 rounds is considered “wrong”?
And the answer is to defend ourselves against our own federal government? Unbelievable.
Let’s say people can possess a nuclear weapon. Consider the people you know. I will simply think of my family, friends, neighbors and business associates. How many could be trusted with their own nuclear weapon? Most, but I would have to hesitate on a few.
How is this different? Well, an assault weapon is easier to carry.
Sure it seems ridiculous doesn’t it? But I can go to Wal-Mart and purchase a semi-automatic and rounds with little trouble. If I want to avoid a background check I can simply go to a gun show.
How about we limit it to six shots? If you can’t manage to either get yourself out of trouble with six shots (or kill your prey in the not overly common practice of hunting anything larger than a squirrel with a handgun) then it simply isn’t your day.
Do you think people have a reasonable chance to get away if the shooter has to stop and reload?
A Bushmaster AR-15 seems to be the weapon of choice as it was used in the Colorado theater shooting, the more recent one in the Oregon mall, was utilized by the DC snipers and was at Adam Lanza’s side, yet it is available for sale at 1700 Wal-Mart stores nationwide (yes, they pulled it after the Sandy Hook shooting for what I am sure were “do the right thing” reasons).
I repeat. Some of these children were shot 11 times and many of you are defending assault weapons?
In that case I have to ask, what would it take for any of you to consider that perhaps the general public should not be able to buy assault weapons at the local department store?
December 18th, 2012 at 2:24 pm
Jay Carney issues this release:
“President Obama is ‘actively supportive’ of planned legislation to reinstate the national ban on assault weapons, a spokesman said Tuesday—one of several signs that the gun industry is facing enormous new pressure, both financial and political, after Friday’s massacre in Newtown….
Jay Carney said that Obama was explicitly supportive of several measures demanded by gun-control groups. He listed a reinstatement of the assault weapons ban, which expired in 2004. …
Carney also said Obama supports closing a loophole that limits scrutiny of weapons sales at gun shows. This was a new level of detail about Obama’s goals for gun legislation. On Monday, officials said the president would set up a group of senior advisers, led by Vice President Biden, to study ideas for reducing gun violence.”
December 18th, 2012 at 4:25 pm
Snow;
“Why can’t anybody answer Buzz’s question?”
Buzz;
“Again, why does anyone need an assault weapon with 30 rounds?”
Its been answered, he just doesnt like the answer.
First, as the laws stand its legal to own one.
Second, its none of his business why I need one.
Third, its not a hundred percent honest question because a semi automatic handgun with 3 or 4 clips can do just as much damage as an AR14 but only take a couple seconds longer.
The hand gun is much easier to conceal, which makes it actually more dangerous.
Fourth, what Buzz considers “our needs” are incredibly subjective.
Fifth, I already gave examples where a population not allowed any guns at all is subjected to force by militant dictators.
Sixth, if our government or infrastructure does collapse to a point of anarchy we’ll be able to defend ourselves against a rogue and oppressive government.
Buzz responds with “Oh, please. This isn’t Syria and if your government wants to “mess” with you there are no amount of assault weapons that will save you.”
And you know this how?
Syria seems to be making progress with only a handful of light munitions
Of course only a liberal doesnt see how Obamas policies will make one day make us look like Syria and Egypt or Greece where the government can no longer afford to pay its departments pay.
Also, no one has answered my question.
Do you want to live in a country where only its military is permitted weapons ?
Theres plenty that can be done besides taking away our core freedoms.
Trigger locks.
Gun safes.
Tech that IDs user
Those who through their own negligence and idiocy allow kooks to get a hold of their guns and commit mass murders should be held just accountable as the trigger man. Accessory to murder, manslaughter by neglect.
Screening process need to be raised quite a few notches.
Mental health services should be held to more access and confidentiality . (its nearly impossible to get a job if you’re discovered to of seen a shrink at anytime)
Stigmata causes folks who need help to not look for it.
We need to stop letting these defective people slip through the cracks.
These mass shootings always end up with one thing in common.
The shooter is always allowed to buy a gun, a maniac, and oddball, a loner, and never has any political or religious beliefs that make sense.
I propose that anyone buying any gun must reveal all psychiatric records to the government and have a psych evaluation done by at least 3 different psychiatrists every 5 years.
And we need stop showing the kids that when you do these fckin horrible things you will not be coddled to but instead made an example of, unless its determined you’re legitimate nut.
You will not rid America of guns anymore than you will drugs.
I know one thing, if the sht ever does hit the fan and I’m stuck on this rock 3000 miles out in the middle of nowhere I will want more than one AR14
December 18th, 2012 at 5:06 pm
Well then why don’t we allow people to have cannons and large arillery?
That way they can better defend themselves against this mythical attack by the U.S. government.
Do I think only the government and police forces should have assault or 30 round semi-automatics?
Sure, why not?
I am not in fear of our federal government and as I said if the government wants to mess with you, good luck. This ain’t Syria and you are going to dissaude them with a few assault weapons.
Of course we could simply call Hollywood and ask them to make “nice” movies like they used to. Oh, that’s right, they made the same movies since the beginning of cinema. “Little Caesar”, or “Public Enemy” anyone?
Again, what would it take for many of you to change your mind? An incident every month? Oops, nevermind, we are almost there.
December 18th, 2012 at 5:12 pm
The well-armed militia to defend ourselves against our own government is simply nonsense and is insulting to even be considered in this context.
There is no reason regular citizens need 30 round semi-automatics. They are just toys for boys that never grew up.
Oh, the heck with it, I give up. If this incident doesn’t change people’s stance than nothing will.
I’m out, there is nothing I can say that is more impactful than what happened.
December 18th, 2012 at 6:01 pm
“I am not in fear of our federal government and as I said if the government wants to mess with you, good luck. This ain’t Syria and you are going to dissaude them with a few assault weapons.”
Well then shut up and let me be the fool.
Only an idiot is not in fear of this government
Syria was an example, shame on me for now knowing you’d use that as some measure.
Go ahead, keep b!tching all you want.
Its our right.
Rights come with responsibilities.
So, I addressed the responsibilities that need to be taken.
Your answer is autocratic and useless.
If the people are not armed a rogue government can assert itself very easily.
If the people do posses weapons the rogue government may think twice about engaging or shooting its own people.
This moron could of stole his mothers car and mowed down 50 people at a bus stop if he wanted to.
Do we outlaw cars ? Just the big heavy ones ?
Hey, suppose I’m single, what the hell do I need a big SUV for ? Or a Porsche that does 200 mph ?
Why do I want an assault rifle when I see my country failing ?
I know Buzz, you love the government, they’d never do that to you.
Problem is,were well on our way to failure.
Id rather be armed and wrong than not armed at all and you be wrong.
“I’m out, there is nothing I can say that is more impactful than what happened.”
More bullsht.
Look to your own for endless “impact”.
Its mostly liberals who are running around shooting each other in the ass.
Take a tour of S. Central LA,Chicago, Detroit, DC,Uptown NYC.
All liberal strongholds.
December 18th, 2012 at 6:54 pm
“How is this different? Well, an assault weapon is easier to carry.”
A Glock with 3 extra clips is even easier to conceal.
Tim McVeigh used cow sht and killed 168 and injured 400
Its the people stupid
December 19th, 2012 at 6:29 am
Buzz,
First off, what is an ‘assault weapon’? I could easily assault a human with a rolled up magazine or even a lollipop stick, causing mortal wounds. Are they assault weapons?
Okay, so lets say an assault weapon is a fully automatic rifle that the manufacturers produce high capacity magazines. Just try buying one of those! Its possible if you go through all of the legal rigamarole. The same is true if you wanted to purchase a howitzer, mortar or even a tank.
What our silly lawmakers and Liberal pundits are talking about are semi-automatic rifles. Guess what? Nearly all rifles sold are semi-auto. True, some folks still buy bolt-action, but those are generally very long range, ultra-large calibers, like .375 Magnums that hunters use for shooting large game animals. While they may only have 5-round magazines, consider this, they do a heck of a lot more damage per round.
Let’s say you can only buy bolt-action rifles. Fine. The Lee-Enfield can carry 10-rounds, reloaded quickly with stripper-clips. British troops were trained in ‘The Mad Minute’, where they could fire 30 aimed shots in one minute. The American Springfield M1903 only had a 5-round reloaded with stripper clips. Our troops were trained to fire 20 aimed shots in one minute.
According to some of the survivors at Sandy Hook, Lanza was shooting for nearly 20 minutes. You do the math. Both the Lee-Enfield and M1903 fire larger, deadly rounds than an AR-15 Bushmaster.
When the police and coroner reports come out, I am willing to bet that part of the reason why all of the victims had 3-11 wounds is probably do to the victims being close together in a confined space where single rounds caused multiple wounds. Call it a ‘herd mentality’ but people tend to bunch up when faced with danger.
As Micky pointed out, Lanza also had two pistols, a Glock and a Sig Sauer, both of which have large magazines, 15-17 round capacities and 30-round after-market clips are available. Lanza also had a shotgun, presumably a 12-gauge pump that probably held 5-6 rounds. Depending on the type of round used, some shotgun shells have a dozen .30 caliber balls per round.
The bottom line is if Lanza did not have a Bushmaster, he still could have done what he did. If he had no guns at all, there are still improvised weapons he could have easily made with just one trip to a hardware or even a grocery store. I won’t give details but believe me, if someone is bent on destruction, they can execute it.
December 19th, 2012 at 6:43 am
So, Buzz,
Why do some of us feel the need for semi-auto rifles with 30-round clips? Well, for starters, if I go to a gun range to shoot paper targets and pay based on time, I don’t want to be wasting time reloading.
The main reason, however, is that I should be able to defend myself in the most appropriate manner. If I’m facing multiple attackers, as is usually the case in home invasions, I need the ability to engage them all. If I’m facing an attack by a hostile force, say troops from an invading army or from a tyrannical government, then I need the ability to counter whatever fire power they bring to the battle.
I heard the Leprechaun, Bill O’Reilly, say the other night that the tyranny argument is silly because the government’s forces would be too strong to fight. Tell that to the Mujahideen, General Giap and General George Washington. They all faced large, well-funded, well trained armies and beat them. True, they tended to lose most of the fights, but in the end, they won the wars.
December 19th, 2012 at 10:14 am
Its kinda sickening.
Every time one of these shootings happens these leftyloonies blame guns and republicans first.
As far as those in the cities I mentioned above its rather ironic that
1) The vast majority are liberals, either black or hispanic.
2) When anyone outside of the elements these cities hold go off on a rampage its the guns fault.
3)When the urban gangsters are pumping lead in to each others asses (black on black violence)its the white mans fault for oppressing them and thereby forcing them to a life of crime.
4)And because of that we need to give these demographics all kinds of assistance.
The lefts policies are the reason we see these inner city gangs flourishing and armed more than any single group in the country, killing more Americans in the last ten years than in any war.
They also know that any gun laws legislated yesterday or next week are a joke because we/they can pretty much get any gun they want any time.
We need to keep the guns out of idiots hands.
Had the Newtowns shooters mom still be alive she should do life for allowing what she knew was a retard to have access to her guns.